Scientology’s enemy turns on Christians
You may have heard of the group that call themselves “Anonymous” - they rose to fame last month due to their on-line campaign against Scientology, the UFO-cult religion founded by the sci-fi writer L. Ron. Hubbard.While we agree with their original goals we did not approve of their method:
I do not think you can simply cure people of scientology without first helping people to know Jesus.When a group of concerned Christians attempted to communicate this simple fact to leaders of the Anonymous group, we were surprised by their harsh vindictive response:
I’m not sure why the Anonymous have got themselves so het-up about our friends at Republican Faith Chat and Blogs4Conservatives - it all seems like a particularly pathetic adolescent revenge fantasy to me.I expect that like all hate-bloggers these folks will grow tired and pick a new target to attack. Last month it was Scientology, this month Christians next month - who knows it might be Negroes or Jews.
Anonymous, if you are reading this - please put away your hatred. Accept Jesus into your life and come to your senses!
Yours in Christ,
Jimmy
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Anonymous has no leader. Each anonymous is equal. Anonymous will not let this slide because anonymous does not forgive or forget. Your final statement shows the fear you have for anonymous.
@jimmy goddard how dare you say to anonymous to put away their hatred you are the last person who should be pointing the finger at them. people who live in glass houses should’nt throw rocks you are indeed the last person who should be pointing the finger at them. you have no right to say that to them. next time you say shit like that take a good hard look at yourself asshole.
I don’t grasp the benefit of insulting Scientologists. I’m a rational, spiritual and creative person who owns two small businesses, has raised two industrious and honest young men, and has been true to my wife since the night I met her. And I’ve been a Scientologist for 40 years.
And as for your “UFO cult” remark, that’s just beneath you. Would you call Judaism a UFO cult because Ezekiel saw a wheel in the sky? And Eastern religions abound with similar references.
How do you help Christianity’s goals by demeaning others who are fighting for the same family values, personal accountability, self-sufficiency, crime-free and drug-free societies, and literate kids that you want, too?
Maybe it’s time for all parties to find allies who will work toward common Earthly goals. *After* that work’s done, let’s have a big dinner and discuss theology.
Very best,
JvG
Tujunga, CA
You have a problem now.
I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢m not sure why the Anonymous have got themselves so het-up about our friends at Republican Faith Chat and Blogs4Conservatives -
B4B posted a piece called “4chan is totally gay”. That was about as smart of them as smoking on a gas station.
“Last month it was Scientology, this month Christians next month - who knows it might be Negroes or Jews.”
They?Ǭ¥re still after the Co$. You are just pasttime.
Now, for a very real assessment:
You can?Ǭ¥t do anything at all that will really harm anonymous.
Anonymous CAN harm you however.
Your best bet is to bunker down and keep a low profile.
And pray that Anonymous looses interest.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
We are anonymous, we never forget, we never forgive. Your activities doesn’t please anonymous either, some day they will be punished too, you are already been hit by the fear of the mighty power of anonymous.
Anonymous, if you are reading this - please put away your hatred. Accept Jesus into your life and come to your senses!”
HA! is it the hypocrisy making such a galant prose????
STR is on drugs yet again.
Your death knell tolleth…
We are anonymous, we never forget, we never forgive. Your activities doesn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t please anonymous either, some day they will be punished too, you are already been hit by the fear of the mighty power of anonymous.
This is why Anonymous needs to accept Jesus - all I hear from them is this empty rhetoric that is supposed to frighten us all, it really cannot affect those of us who have the spiritual armor of Jesus.
And as for your ?¢‚Ǩ?ìUFO cult?¢‚Ǩ¬ù remark, that?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s just beneath you. Would you call Judaism a UFO cult because Ezekiel saw a wheel in the sky? And Eastern religions abound with similar references.
JvG, I am sad to have to answer this question because I know that if you really are a scientologist your internet filtering software will prevent you from reading my reply. Scientology most certainly is a UFO cult - if you had reached OT-VII in your cult you would know this for a fact (however you may be forbidden from revealing that you know it because L. Ron. Hubbard cursed people who spread his secrets with Pneumonia of all things).
Yours in Christ,
Jimmy
Feel free to post my email response to you on this matter. It was comprehensive.
And–to shoot down another ridiculous misconception about Scientology–no one *cursed* anyone with anything. That’s just hooey. Curses are junk anyway.
The actual *observation of factual events* was that some people exposed to the upper-level materials of Scientology—without having the proper spiritual preparation—DID FACTUALLY get sick with pneumonia.
Enjoy all the opinions you please about the rightness of your religion. We each have our rights to do so. But please do not misrepresent Scientology.
The others who do that are extremely unethical people. You probably don’t want to be on their side about anything. “Anonymous” are factually, per point of law, cybercriminals.
Stop bitching whore!!!
-Jer Snider
“This is why Anonymous needs to accept Jesus - all I hear from them is this empty rhetoric that is supposed to frighten us all, it really cannot affect those of us who have the spiritual armor of Jesus. ”
You perhaps don?Ǭ¥t know it, but right now, you?Ǭ¥re committing a huuuuuuuuge mistake…
Don?Ǭ¥t toy with the bull or the bull will toy with you.
“I don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t grasp the benefit of insulting Scientologists. I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢m a rational, spiritual and creative person who owns two small businesses, has raised two industrious and honest young men, and has been true to my wife since the night I met her. And I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve been a Scientologist for 40 years”
Anonymous does NOT target you. It targets the Sientology organisation, which is evidently committing criminal practises and has a rather strong anti-democracy doctrine in all it takes. This is not aimed at you, this is aimed at the guys that are corrupting your belief for their own ends.
“And?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúto shoot down another ridiculous misconception about Scientology?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúno one *cursed* anyone with anything. That?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s just hooey. Curses are junk anyway. ”
But “fair game” sadly isn?Ǭ¥t.
“?¢‚Ǩ?ìAnonymous?¢‚Ǩ¬ù are factually, per point of law, cybercriminals.”
Wrong. Some of them are. But the vast majority does not engage in criminal action. “Anonymous” is basically the prevalent opinions of the internet society taking shape.
This is also the reason why legal action is worse than futile against anonymous.
The German Guy
IMEPACH BUSH!
@ Jer Snider who were you referring to when you said stop bitching whore?
Dear German Guy:
Again, the fact-challenged allegation that there’s anything corrupt about the management of Scientology is just more Internet bunk. But you’ve heard it so often that you’ve not once asked foe anyone to back up their statements.
Far from fearing police contact, we Scientologists work hand in hand with them in their tutoring projects, helping resolve family disputes, and having their speakers come to the churches.
Where is one shred of _half-way_recent_ evidence that anyone in church management has done anything wrong?! No convictions, no trials, no indictments. Not even inquires! Nothing. It’s all made up hate-speech. (I concede that a band of dopes did screw up badly back in the 1970s. Because the FBI was sending plants into our churches, they went into the FBI to get evidence. Not smart. AND against church regs and policy, too.)
We _crushed_ the most recent (2007) charges against us in Russia (made for political reasons, no surprise).
Even Germany, which began investigating (read “persecuting”) some 30 smaller churches, has had to admit that after some 15 years of observation of Scientology, nothing has been found.
In the USA, when the IRS audited a literal truckload of our financials, they _really_ wanted to nail us for something. End result? Total exoneration and full religious tax-exemption for every Scientology church, mission, and public betterment group.
Next time someone tosses out those easy-to-mouth charges, ask them for recent facts from a country that isn’t already persecuting a slew of other new religions.
Much love!
Once and for all, this is the caliber or people that inhabit “Anonymous”:
http://youtube.com/user/AnonymousFacts
When you see this, you’ll see from Anonymous’s own words who they are at their sick core. That will make it unforgettably clear why they hate Christians, revile Blacks, and attack Scientology and its social betterment projects.
“Again, the fact-challenged allegation that there?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s anything corrupt about the management of Scientology is just more Internet bunk. But you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve heard it so often that you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve not once asked foe anyone to back up their statements.”
Unfortunately for you, I experienced that “bunk” myself and can readily say that it is NOT bunk at all.
“Far from fearing police contact, we Scientologists work hand in hand with them in their tutoring projects, helping resolve family disputes, and having their speakers come to the churches. ”
Yet you divorce people of their families, threaten people and engage ina ative harassment.
“Where is one shred of _half-way_recent_ evidence that anyone in church management has done anything wrong?! No convictions, no trials, no indictments.”
LOL.
1999: Greece: Scientologists found guilty
15 Scientologists were accused of systematically keeping files on politicians, journalists, judges, clergymen and other Greek leading personalities. The Scientologists were found guilty, but they were not sentenced, due to procedural errors. (In other words, they got off on a technicality.)
In 1998, a judge ordered the Scientology organization in Athens to stop operating, since the organization was established under false pretenses. According to the ruling, the organization was not operating as a non-profit, and was putting people’s mental and physical health at risk.
1997: Italy: Scientologists jailed
29 Scientologists were sentenced to jail for criminal association.
1996: France: Scientology executive found guilty of involuntary homicide
“A former Church of Scientology leader was convicted Friday of involuntary homicide and sentenced to 18 months in prison in the 1988 suicide of a church member. Twelve other defendants facing lesser charges - theft, complicity or abuse of confidence - were given suspended sentences of eight to 15 months each. Charges were dropped against 10 others.” The Scientologists were charged in the death of Patrice Vic.
1996: France: Scientologists guilty of interfering with a witness
Three Scientologists were given suspended prison sentences for interfering with an expert witness in a Lyon trial. Charges of theft were proven.
1995: Canada: Scientology pays the largest libel award in Canadian history
Scientology was found guilty of libelling Casey Hill, the prosecutor responsible for bringing Scientology to justice for its egregious illegal acts in Canada.
1994: USA: Scientology fined for filing a frivolous lawsuit
Helena Kobrin, representing RTC (a Scientology corporation), was fined $17,775 for filing a frivolous lawsuit. (Using the law to harass critics is Scientology policy.)
1992: Canada: Scientology found guilty of breach of the public trust
Scientology itself and three Scientology executives were found guilty of breach of public trust in a case involving the theft of information from government offices.
1989: USA: Scientology Found Guilty of Inflicting Emotional Distress
In 1986, former Scientologist Larry Wollersheim sued Scientology for intentional infliction of emotional distress. The jury awarded him $35,000,000, which was reduced on appeal to $2,500,000. Scientology refuses to pay, and now owes Larry more than twice that (with interest accruing).
The appeals court agreed that Larry had been badly hurt by Scientology: it found that Scientology “coerced Wollersheim into continued participation,” “seized Wollersheim and held him captive,” and that “the Church’s conduct was manifestly outrageous.” In October 1997, the court found that the Church of Scientology International and Religious Technology Center are liable for the debt.
1984: USA: Clearwater Police Investigator Recommends RICO Charges
Lt. Ray Emmons investigated Scientology as part of his duties. He found clear evidence of fraud and other crimes and recommended that federal and state authorities prosecute Scientology under anti-racketeering laws.
1980: USA: Top-ranking Scientologists guilty of burglary, forgery, infiltration, and obstruction of justice
Eleven Scientology executives, including L. Ron Hubbard’s wife, pled guilty to a number of serious crimes. The stipulation of evidence included the following statement: “At all times material to the indictment, L. Ron Hubbard was, by virtue of his role as the founder and leader or Scientology, overall supervisor of the Guardian’s Office.”
1979: USA: Julie Christofferson Titchbourne sues Scientology for fraud
Julie Christofferson Titchbourne sued Scientology for fraud and outrageous conduct. She won her original trial and the first appeal; Scientology appealed a second time but settled with Julie before that appeal was heard.
1978: France: Fraud
Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard was convicted of fraud in a trial held in absentia.
And that?Ǭ¥s just the tip of the iceberg. That?Ǭ¥s what you get from a 2-minute-googling!
“Even Germany, which began investigating (read ?¢‚Ǩ?ìpersecuting?¢‚Ǩ¬ù) some 30 smaller churches, has had to admit that after some 15 years of observation of Scientology, nothing has been found. ”
Yadda, yadda. Don?Ǭ¥t play the persecution card, it won?Ǭ¥t work. And they evidently found enough to never give you the status of a church. That alone speaks for itself, especially as ALL major political parties have that antipathy in common, something you almost exclusively share with communists and nazis.
Your are a troll. You fail. Your petty rhetoric falls flat on its ass for anyone daring to do just a bit of recherche. Try again next time you try making propaganda, this attempt was pathetic.
“When you see this, you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ll see from Anonymous?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s own words who they are at their sick core. That will make it unforgettably clear why they hate Christians, revile Blacks, and attack Scientology and its social betterment projects.”
And yet they are right about Scientology. Oh, and show me some evidence that Anonymous as a whole “hate Christians and revile Blacks”.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
Anyone can claim to be a member of Anonymous. The true entity that is Anonymous is so disorganized that any attempt at orchestration will lead to inactivity. Blah, blah, blah. Normally I would give a detailed explanation with supporting evidence, but I really don’t care anymore.
We are anonymous.Anonymous does not forgive or forget.we are everywhere.We know who you are, you don’t know who we are.Your day shall come.
NEW location for the expos?ɬ© video of the crimes of Anonymous:
http://www.anonymous-exposed.org/
Good Christians can choose sides: Anonymous are admitted cyberterrorists who admittedly hijack other people’s PCs to help crash Web sites, who have hacked Fox News when they didn’t like their coverage, and whose leaders (not all members) have admitted on the Web to child pornography.
OR you can quietly root for this religion that’s new to you. The Scientology religion only grows because it factually delivers help, good classes, and life-changing counseling. Then its volunteers staff up COMPLETELY NON-RELIGIOUS literacy classes, ESL classes, criminal education and morality reform, and anti-drug lectures in public schools. Hundreds of its Volunteer Ministers ehlped out after Katrina and other U.S. disasters, the Indonesian Tsunami, LA violence, 9/11 cleanup, and earthquakes in South America.
No, Scientologists aren’t Christian, but neither are Jews, Hindus, Daoists, etc. You get along with them okay, don’t you?
Much love,
TF
“NEW location for the expos?ɬ© video of the crimes of Anonymous:
http://www.anonymous-exposed.org/
Good Christians can choose sides: Anonymous are admitted cyberterrorists who admittedly hijack other people?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s PCs to help crash Web sites, who have hacked Fox News when they didn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t like their coverage, and whose leaders (not all members) have admitted on the Web to child pornography. ”
And yet there is still no evidence whatsoever that the ENTIRETY of anonymous took part in this or even knew about some members doing it. THat?Ǭ¥s becuase Anonymous doesn?Ǭ¥t have something like a leadership, it?Ǭ¥s a complete open and (who?Ǭ¥d thought it?) anonymous group. Btw, that Fox airing was, oh well, hilarious. Especially that exploding van, anonymous is using this one as a meme ever since to mock Fox.
That also makes the child pornography claim null and void. To spell it out for those braindead that still haven?Ǭ¥t got it: ANONYMOUS DOESN?Ǭ¥T HAVE A LEADERSHIP!
“OR you can quietly root for this religion that?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s new to you. The Scientology religion only grows because it factually delivers help, good classes, and life-changing counseling.”
It also forces people to pay ridiculous sums of money or basically become a slave of the organisation, uses intimidation, threats, blackmail, harrassment and actual violence as well as completely unfounded lawsuits to silence critics, follows a decidedly anti-democracy worldview and tries to convert people via hidden means like front companies.
I?Ǭ¥m not arguing against the faith of scientologists here, but against the very real deeds of the Scientology organisation that make it nothing else but criminal.
“Then its volunteers staff up COMPLETELY NON-RELIGIOUS literacy classes, ESL classes, criminal education and morality reform, and anti-drug lectures in public schools.”
Without ever informing people about their “religion” and actively trying to advertise Scientology and convert people. IE, shiny PR and nothing else. At least most christian charities don?Ǭ¥t try that stuff.
“No, Scientologists aren?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t Christian, but neither are Jews, Hindus, Daoists, etc. You get along with them okay, don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t you?”
THey are also not quite as aggressive towards criticism and don?Ǭ¥t use suspect methods to gain members, unlike Scientology. Now for real, your organisation should learn that the more one tries to surpress informations, the more likely they will be flung into your face.
Scientology pretty much deserves being called a dangerous cult exactly because they act like one against anyone criticising them in the slightest.
You?Ǭ¥re nothing but a Co$-troll and likely even paid to bring this stupid propaganda into the web. That?Ǭ¥s at least one xplanation why you completely ignore any accusations towards Scientology and instead try to divert by attacking anon. How typical “always attack, never defend”. Answer some points or get lost.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
And here?Ǭ¥s another hint: The mere accussation of anon to commit hate-crime and hate-soeech towards a religion with their actions by itself exposed the site you linked as just another patethic attempt on slander and propaganda.
And cutting down on anon?Ǭ¥s message as to completely rip parts out of context isn?Ǭ¥t any better, especially as anyone can find the full message at youtube.
Faking the phone calls and especially the faxes is even worse. The majority of anon has a bit more creativity than THAT.
And then that “exposing vid” brings up the fake message, which has allegedly not been from Anonymous in the first place, but from some idiot trying to seize the moment. The differrent GlaDOS is a dead giveaway of a bad copy.
Then the anthrax thing. Now really, does anyone believe such utterly idiotic claims?
And then the next bomb threat: Another GlaDOS, thus fake. Especially as Anonymous doesn?Ǭ¥t refer to Scientology as a religion AT ALL. Neither do most of it?Ǭ¥s other enemies either. This alone pretty much indicates the Nitro-threat to be actually MANUFACTURED by the Co$ itself in an attempt of pure and utter slander. This alone pretty much destroys any shred of credibility the video might have had beforehand.
And the rest of the video just continues with the same kind of ridiculous propaganda attempting to slander Anonymous. Here?Ǭ¥s a catch: Even if they were as bad as described in that piece of shit, htey?Ǭ¥d STILL be right about Scientology. CASE CLOSED!
Someone should also care reading Operation Chanology?Ǭ¥s manifest, especially the part where they point out that they are fighting the Co$?Ǭ¥s organisation and not the religion per se.
So stick that religious persecution card up your ***, it doesn?Ǭ¥t do you any good here, junior.
It seems the Co$ is still clueless about the kind of enemy they just made themselves. Anonymous can?Ǭ¥t be threatened, can?Ǭ¥t be sued, can?Ǭ¥t be harrassed. And thus, all measures Scientology takes to silence it?Ǭ¥s critics are completely and totally worthless against anon. Such it down, you?Ǭ¥re loosing this.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
Sir, I offer the idea that, if you will sit back and look at your writing on this topic, you sill see that you have some emotions worked up about Scientology that are cutting into your otherwise I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢m sure respectable intelligence.
I know you can’t live the rest of your business and personal life confusing anyone?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s wild negative accusation with fact, echoing hate-speech as if it were reality and–most of all–accusing people in your life and business without any evidence. I just know you don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t really live like that.
I PROMISE YOU if I, or any Scientologist, learned that any of that junk were true, it would be our duty (and our quiet pleasure) to report the guilty party–to include FACTS WE KNEW OR SAW FIRST-HAND–and get them straightened out in accordance with a prime Church directive, “DON’T DO ANYTHING ILLEGAL.”
In fact, when one exec was found to be dishonest?¢‚Ǩ‚Äùback in the early 1980?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s?¢‚Ǩ‚Äùa short publication came out commending the person who had first noticed and reported him.
Scientologists aren’t magically perfect the day they start their first class: it’s a gradual striving toward self-improvement. So obviously it’s possible some Scientologist somewhere is doing something wrong. Perhaps you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve noticed that occurring on other religions, too. BUT the clean-up mechanisms are there to keep anyone who goes outside the law on the straight and narrow, per that datum above about obeying the laws of the land.
IF there were one shred of fact supporting those foundationless allegations that you type in, don’t you think one of the victims would have gone to the feds and gotten an investigation started?
Do you think we would have gotten our full and complete tax exemption? Don’t you think the USA’s ravenous IRS would have jumped down our throat on ANY imperfection it could find to justify getting a share of our donations?
Sir, you are obviously intelligent in various other arenas, but you are not directing your analytical “smarts” at THIS matter.
No evidence means no victims, means no untoward practices, means that the accusations are without evidence, and are just angry people.
The proelem does not lie within Scientology or its management. It lies within the psyches of those who must attack something. If there were no Scientology, these people would be attacking Jews or Muslims or blacks or Bush or Obama or Hillary or Catholics or someone else.
It?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s just that simple.
[...] -STR plans on throwing bibles at Anonymous [...]
“Sir, I offer the idea that, if you will sit back and look at your writing on this topic, you sill see that you have some emotions worked up about Scientology that are cutting into your otherwise I?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢m sure respectable intelligence. ”
Those emotions are unfortunately rightly grounded in experiences some people I can honestly call friends as well as myself have had. Simply put, I watched Scientology?Ǭ¥s modus operandi live and in color, with my own two eyes.
“I know you can?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t live the rest of your business and personal life confusing anyone?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s wild negative accusation with fact, echoing hate-speech as if it were reality and?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúmost of all?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúaccusing people in your life and business without any evidence. I just know you don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t really live like that.”
Says the one that presented a video chock full of cheaply produced slanderous accussations without any evidence backing up most of it…..
“I PROMISE YOU if I, or any Scientologist, learned that any of that junk were true, it would be our duty (and our quiet pleasure) to report the guilty party?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúto include FACTS WE KNEW OR SAW FIRST-HAND?¢‚Ǩ‚Äúand get them straightened out in accordance with a prime Church directive, ?¢‚Ǩ?ìDON?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢T DO ANYTHING ILLEGAL.?¢‚Ǩ¬ù”
Yeah, riiiiight. Your “church” has broken that commitment so often, one should add “as long as you?Ǭ¥re not caught.”
“Scientologists aren?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t magically perfect the day they start their first class: it?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s a gradual striving toward self-improvement. So obviously it?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s possible some Scientologist somewhere is doing something wrong. Perhaps you?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢ve noticed that occurring on other religions, too. BUT the clean-up mechanisms are there to keep anyone who goes outside the law on the straight and narrow, per that datum above about obeying the laws of the land.”
The problem is that the constant harrassment of ex-members, critics and the like as well as the host of completely unfounded lawsuits aimed at silencing any opposition are far too well organised to be the work of a few stragglers.
“IF there were one shred of fact supporting those foundationless allegations that you type in, don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t you think one of the victims would have gone to the feds and gotten an investigation started? ”
I did post quite a list of ongoing investigations, or such that already brought something rotten up just a few posts ago…talk about baseless.
“Do you think we would have gotten our full and complete tax exemption? Don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t you think the USA?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s ravenous IRS would have jumped down our throat on ANY imperfection it could find to justify getting a share of our donations?”
Lobbying and expensive lawyers. It?Ǭ¥s a shame that one can come so far with those tools in today?Ǭ¥s USA.
“Sir, you are obviously intelligent in various other arenas, but you are not directing your analytical ?¢‚Ǩ?ìsmarts?¢‚Ǩ¬ù at THIS matter.”
No, I?Ǭ¥m simply refusing to miss all the damning evidence that you as an indoctrinated Scientologist have been told to ignore.
“No evidence means no victims, means no untoward practices, means that the accusations are without evidence, and are just angry people. ”
Again, too bad that there has been both evidence as well as accusations I can personaly testify to be as accurrate as it can get.
“The proelem does not lie within Scientology or its management. It lies within the psyches of those who must attack something. If there were no Scientology, these people would be attacking Jews or Muslims or blacks or Bush or Obama or Hillary or Catholics or someone else. ”
And this is just making excuses. It?Ǭ¥s the Co$ after all that?Ǭ¥s suing anyone even daring to say a single bad word about them, actively harrassing people and generally acting in a way that can positively be compared to the way quite a few tyrrannies treated their PR.
The German Guy
INMPEACH BUSH!
“Thou doth protest to much, methinks”
Geeez, PG, all you do is repeat your fact-deprived charges without citing _*MODERN*_ _*USA-BASED*_ examples. And if you dislike the USA so much, the Fatherland will still welcome your bigotry with warm, stiff-arm salutes.
Show me some modern, USA-based examples of any _*illegalities*_–even one!–and we can have another go at a rational conversation.
I always like sparring with quick people but your problem is that you just don’t use facts. You use arm-waving, foot-stomping and repeated, redundant, repetitive repetition ;>) [sorry, couldn't resist that!] in an untenable effort to make un-makeable points.
Till then, your assignment is to write 1000 words on how the astute student would differentiate fact from accusation.
Big hugs! I know you can do better.
“Geeez, PG, all you do is repeat your fact-deprived charges without citing _*MODERN*_ _*USA-BASED*_ examples. And if you dislike the USA so much, the Fatherland will still welcome your bigotry with warm, stiff-arm salutes.”
And why exactly should I only use USA-based examples? BEcause that?Ǭ¥d fit you better? And nice play on an absolutely outdated clich?ɬ© here.
Okay, here I go just for the pending stuff:
Trial pending: USA: Fraud
A trust established by L. Ron Hubbard is one of several parties sued by attorneys seeking to recover funds; several of the suits allege fraud.
Trial pending: USA: Fraud, false imprisonment, assault, extortion, kidnapping, defamation, invasion of privacy, infliction of emotional distress, and racketeering
Michael Pattinson is suing Scientology for several counts of fraud and a variety of other extremely serious charges. The suit garnered some national press (including stories in the Guide and Fab! and at MSNBC ) because it names John Travolta, alleging that Scientology claimed they could “cure” Pattinson’s homosexuality and used Travolta as an example of a homosexual whose orientation they had changed.
Trial pending: USA: Lisa McPherson - Wrongful Death, Practicing Medicine Without a License, Torture, more
The state of Florida has decided not to prosecute the two felony charges of unauthorized practice of medicine and abuse and/or neglect of a disabled adult in the case of Lisa McPherson, who died in Scientology’s custody on December 5, 1995. However, a civil suit has been filed by her estate, alleging wrongful death, intentional infliction of emotional distress, false imprisonment, fraud, battery, negligence, and practicing medicine without a license.
Other people have also reported fraud, the unauthorized practice of medicine, and false imprisonment.
PS: I don?Ǭ¥t dislike the USA in any way. I do dislike the attitude of some americans, but I?Ǭ¥m quite able to distinguish them from the whole country.
“I always like sparring with quick people but your problem is that you just don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t use facts. You use arm-waving, foot-stomping and repeated, redundant, repetitive repetition ;>) [sorry, couldn?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t resist that!] in an untenable effort to make un-makeable points. ”
*SIgh* If you weren?Ǭ¥t a very active case of ferrus cranus, you?Ǭ¥d have perhaps made your own search, too. But then, I?Ǭ¥m talking to a Scientologist here, I?Ǭ¥d be very surprised if one would try to find out bad facts about the organisation by himself.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
PS:
GO, TEXAS, GO!
http://www.anonhouston.com/wiki/Image:Resolutionsmall.jpg
Man, what filth in that blog.
By your every sentence, your sociopathic hatreds, and your puerile word choice, you encapsulate and epitomize all that is, and all who are, obsessively anti-Christian or anti-Scientology.
No site could more perfectly clarify why you hate two religions that reach out into the world to help and upgrade its people.
“By your every sentence, your sociopathic hatreds, and your puerile word choice, you encapsulate and epitomize all that is, and all who are, obsessively anti-Christian or anti-Scientology. ”
Oh, playing the “manners” card, I see. Wow, you should try googling for something called the style over substance fallacy.
“No site could more perfectly clarify why you hate two religions that reach out into the world to help and upgrade its people.”
Baseless assumption/accusation. Who would?Ǭ¥ve thought it… Your “arguments” become more and more pathetic. I?Ǭ¥m not hating any religion. What I hate are self-righteous braggers that think they know all the answers and act as if anyone not thinking their way is somehow deranged. Which is pretty much the attitude of *any* religious extremist zealot.
What I also hate are ignorant morons that are too blinded by their own believes to question them at all. Asking questions is what brought us out of the Dark Ages and anyone actively wanting to stop doing it really only deserves mockery and a scoffing.
PS: I also can?Ǭ¥t stand partisan argument makers that don?Ǭ¥t answer their opponents points with any hard facts but instead spout some randon propaganda or even ignore them.
The German Guy
IMPEACH BUSH!
1) PG, In my post above mentioning “sociopathic hatreds, and your puerile word choice,” I wasn’t referring to you, but to the “Trackback” blog below. Relax. Decaffeinate. I certainly could have been clearer. Mea culpa.
2) The anonhouston post resolution will go as far as a 400-pound shotput. _I_ can argue down all its positions, and I’m no lawyer. It’s a really lame attempt by some politico who has been ill-informed by hate-mongers. Actually, such thoroughly fail-doopmed attempts help us over all. God that was pathetid. I’m almost sorry you posted it; it’s that vapid.
3) Thank you! I think I’ve finally got you arguing like a rational person! (See your post #24 above.) (Well, except for your backsliding on that last explosive post, #27.)
But you have at last provided me some (allegedly) present-time examples from a country (USA) whose judicial system I trust a leeeeeetle more than those decades-old Reichstag/SS-type/wig-wearing regimes you were quoting earlier.
You’re making great strides toward rational discourse.
Let me check those out and get back to you. (Geez, FINALLY.)
5) And, BTW, the rest of your generalities and “I hate people who…” statements don’t apply to me or any other Scientologist that *I would hang out with. Yes, that would be distasteful.
To agree with you, here is point 7 from “The Creed of the Church of Scientology”:
“That all men have inalienable rights to think freely, to talk freely, to write freely their own opinions and to counter or utter or write upon the opinions of others”
That ain’t so terrible,is it?
ttfn!
Dear PG,
All three examples you cite in #24 above are bogus. You have fallen victim to anti-Scientology hate-sites’ lies and fact-free accusations.
MICHAEL PATTINSON’s ridiculous case against the Church was tossed out (or voluntarily withdrawn) *six* times times. Judges scolded Pattinson’s attorney for being a “vexatious litigant” and threatened him with legal sanctions. The *California* *Bar* brought charges against that same attorney and he agreed to have his own law license revoked for 9 months.
LISA McPHERSON’s final case was settled with the payment of a nuisance amount to Lisa’s *estranged* aunt–who hadn’t spoken to her for years–but did wriggle out of the woodwork to sue the Church.
RON HUBBARD’S TRUST?:
And whatever imaginary case “trust established by L. Ron Hubbard” refers to, I can’t find any evidence of it anywhere–except on an anti-Scientology hate-site. They cite no evidence: no date, court name, plaintiff, attorney names; nor the name of alleged trust.
Probably they are purposefully vague because it was an imaginary story, or such a stretch they didn’t dare specify exact records.
Please let me know any future concerns.
You say Anonymous is full of hatred. It’s ironic that you do not see that we’re merely a mirror. The hatred you see resides in your own soul. We hate for the Lulz. Where does your hate stem from?
We do not align ourselves with you or christianity to take down scientology for the same reason we do not team with them to take down you. One, we do not need help; Anonymous only needs Anonymous. Two, while you may believe you to be better than the other, you are equally guilty in the eyes of Anonymous. Third, unlike you, Anonymous holds no prejudices in the fact that we hold all prejudice. We do not pick favorites and the internet hate machine breaks for no one. Except maybe Rick Astley.
This is not over; trust these words.
and expect us.
Anonymous should expect the FBI. I just read tech news casually, and these are things I remember:
Hacked into the epileptics’ site and purposefully planted flashing bright light images, knowing their actions would cause seizures. One woman reported they were her worst epileptic seizures ever.
Hacked into FoxNews when that network criticized them for being Internet thugs and criminals. (Now, don’t be upset Anony-wonnie, you say you believe in truth, right?)
Started the whole mess by breaking into the scientologists’ Web site, taking it off line for days. Problem is they also took down the church’s public-service sites that offer drug addiction prevention services, tutoring & the like. Maybe anon’s meds were wearing off?
And they followed that up by a day or two of death threats orchestrated to come into the church by fax, phone and email and jam its communications mechanisms.
They are sick little kids, and a few brain-nuked adults, whose attitude for other people’s rights exactly matches any garden-variety criminal’s attitudes.
But then it also matches that of an unsocialized two-year-old.